[ayso45-refs] question about un-tied shoes

Mon Oct 2 17:23:46 EDT 2006

Mark,

I would have done the same if I were you.  He or his teammates (even
coaches/parents) could have called for injury/time out but he chose to walk
off the field.

I would have done the same on own goals but not 100% sure in 5 on 5 games.

Rex
  -----Original Message-----
  From: ayso45-refs-bounces at ayso45.org
[mailto:ayso45-refs-bounces at ayso45.org]On Behalf Of Mark Shustock
  Sent: Monday, October 02, 2006 1:15 PM
  To: David Luskin; Robert L. Henderson; ayso45-refs
  Subject: Re: [ayso45-refs] question about un-tied shoes

  I have a question.... this happened to me on Saturday while I was ref'ing
a 5 on 5 game...

  At mid-field a player kicked the ball straight into the stomach of a
player on the opposite team.  He was trying to clear the ball and kicked it
hard and high - nothing deliberate.  The child that was hit remained
standing and appeared ok.  He was not crying.  He appeared calm.  However,
he immediately started walking off the field under his own power.  I did not
stop play.  As he was walking to the sideline the other team initiated a
fast break and ran down the field (with me following) and scored a goal.  I
allowed the goal to stand.  However, I could sense that the other team was
upset I did not stop play for the injury.  But, to me, it didn't look like a
serious injury.  He walked off the field under his own power.  I think he
was just shaken up and didn't know what else to do.   And the goal happened
so fast - maybe 15 seconds after the incident.

  WHAT SHOULD I HAVE DONE?

  Next question, what about own goals in 5 on 5 games?  Should they stand or
not?  I allowed one two weeks ago but someone on the sideline who said he
was a ref told me (after the game) that I should not have let it stand.  If
not, how should I restart play?

  Thanks!

  ----- Original Message ----
  From: David Luskin <luskin at pacbell.net>
  To: Robert L. Henderson <bob at starshippilot.com>; ayso45-refs
<ayso45-refs at ayso45.org>
  Sent: Monday, October 2, 2006 11:52:37 AM
  Subject: Re: [ayso45-refs] question about un-tied shoes

  The problem is, due to the wonders of Velcro, many children do not know
how
  to tie their own shoes.  I believe they figure it out before they graduate
  from High School, but whereas in the old days every child knew by 5 years
  old, even at the U9 level a significant number of children do not know
how.

  So it is not a matter of simply telling/yelling to the child to tie his
  shoes when he has a chance.  Rather an adult is needed.  A referee can't
ref
  while he is tying a shoe.  Further, if a ref decides to risk ignoring play
  for a minute to tie a players shoe while play is away from the child,
while
  you are in the middle of tying play can return to the player.  This then
has
  the effect of putting the players team down a person as the player is
rooted
  in place while their shoe is being tied.  Plus the risk and problems
  associated with ref being unavailable for a minute or so.

  Another option is to send the child to the sideline for a coach or parent
to
  tie their shoe while play continues.  This has the unfortunate effect of
  putting the team down by one player.  And if the child happens to be a
  critical defender, it might end up being the reason another team scores a
  goal.

  Of course, one can reason that if the opposing team scores a goal because
a
  child is involved in having their shoes tied that is their penalty for not
  taking care of it properly in the first place.  But, as the child is
likely
  not who tied their shoe in the first place, this does not seem to conform
to
  "safe, fun, and fair".  In particular, not fair, as well as not fun.

  So, with lots of ignorance, I would suggest that for some age groups
  (perhaps U9 and below) that some stop of play be allowed for tying of
laces.
  If the problem seems out of control, such as maybe more than one or two
  stoppages in a half, then the ref could tell the coaches that the next
time
  it occurs a player will be sent to the sideline for a coach or parent to
  handle the problem and play will not be stopped.

  Regards,
  David Luskin

  -----Original Message-----
  From: ayso45-refs-bounces at ayso45.org
[mailto:ayso45-refs-bounces at ayso45.org]
  On Behalf Of Robert L. Henderson
  Sent: Saturday, September 30, 2006 8:29 PM
  To: thad at yahoo.com; ayso45-refs
  Subject: Re: [ayso45-refs] question about un-tied shoes

  Generally, there is no need to stop play unless you feel the player is
  in immediate risk.    The player should be told to tie the shoe and can
  do this while play is away from that player, such as at the other end of
  the field.   If play has stopped (for a throw-in, free kick, etc),  you
  may hold up the restart to allow the player to deal with the shoe.

  Thad White wrote:
  > Hi Bob,
  >
  > I have another question about stopping the game for untied shoes.  I
  assume
  > that this is ok since it is an unsafe condition.  But I don't remember
any
  > specific training on this.  Could you just confirm that this is reason
for
  > stopping play and then resuming with a no-fault drop ball?
  >
  > Thanks,
  > Thad
  >
  >
  >
  >

  --
  Bob Henderson
    Starships piloted
      Dragons slain
        Soccer Refereed

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